Author Topic: The Art of War Dothraki Translation  (Read 958 times)

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HoeriVezhof

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The Art of War Dothraki Translation
« on: April 10, 2017, 03:23:47 pm »
Just a quick, rough translation of the first chapter of the Sun Tzu's the Art of War. Below are the words I had to derive in the order they appear. As always, please point out any errors, suggestions, etc. I used three different English translations, Lionel Giles', Thomas cleary, and the Shonshi Group's but follow no particular style.

Giles: http://classics.mit.edu/Tzu/artwar.html
Cleary: http://web.mit.edu/~dcltdw/AOW/toc.html
Shonshi: https://www.sonshi.com/original-the-art-of-war-translation-not-giles.html

Athvilajerar
Vitiherikh

Athvilajerar olda khalasar san. Me olda m'atthirar m'athdrivar. Me olda m'atthirar m'athdrivar. Me os che atthirozaraan che athohhararaan. Majin vitiheras mae. Majin vitiheras jin mek davrakh zana. Vineseras mora kash  yer akkeleni zigerekh yer anajahi. Mori mek: ma Os, ma chafasar, ma Gache, m'Akkelenak m'Athniqar. Akkelenas athhajar yeri she jini ma vavvenas mora athhajaraan dozgi.

   Os olda athfiezar vi yanqosor ma khal. Ovvethikh mae eth vena yeri mori asili yera ma m'atthirar m'athdrivar vo voldi mora akkate yomme athzhowakaroon.
   Chafasar olda m'ajjalanes m'asshekhes, m'athfishar m'athafazhar, ma kashe ma vigillosorer [seasons].
   Gache olda athhezhahar ma yatha ma zoha, ma hezhaha ma qisi, ma ovaha ma thifa; ma Gach fini ray nem jaz ma Gach disa, ma zhowaka ma sandi.
   Akkelenak olda m'athvillar ma shillikh m'atherinar m'atherokhar m'athniqezar. (che Akkelenak ma villa ma nem shilla ma erina ma erokhae ma niqa.)
   Athniqar olda m'athkelenar lajasari ki saccheyi jila, m'athkelenar khasari, m'athzanar osi fin nem fichi zigerekh lajasaraan meshes, m'athjavrathar athziradakhezari masi.

Ei ko ray char jin mek davrakh. Fin shila mora anajaha; fin vo shila mora anajaha vosecchi. Majin m'akkelenas m'avvenas athhajar yeri she jini athhajaraan dozgi m'akkelenas fin ahajana. Qafas: mra qora fini khali Os? Mra qora fini oakah? Finaan adavrani ma Chafasar ma Gach? Athniqar fini avezhvenana? Lajasar fini ahajana? Ma khasar ma lajaki fini ray lajish k'athadavrani? Fin m'azha qorasokh m'annitha k'athazanani? ki jini vitiherikhi Anha laz assik ma fin anajaha ma fin vohara.

Ko fin charoe athvillar anni ma addavrae mae anajaha sekosshi: aqqisi mae! Ko fin ma vo charoe athvillar anni ma vo addavrae mae, hazak vohara: eqorasa mae!Addavras assokh anni ma fonas davrakh fini koala avijazeri melikhoon vo nem tiha. Ovvahas ostirge kash ovrakh nem eza.

Athvilajerar os qosarvenikhi. Majin, Hash yer laz ildi, hash attihas meyer vo laz ildi; hash yer nithie, attihas meyer vo nithie; hash yer qisi, attihas meyer hezhahi; hash yer hezhahi,  attihas meyer qisi. Annithilas dozge ki ovrakhi ido. Iddos athekelenazar ma atthasas mae kash me navvirzethaya. Hash me samvena, hash hethkas moon. Hash me ahajana, hash zajjas lajat mae. Hash me safejasa, hash zireyeses mae. Hash me choma, hash annithilas mae esittesalat. Hash mra qora mae athdisizar, ahhaqas mae. Hash lajasar nem yanqo, sachas mae. Ildas finne me ehethkae, es finne me vos ayoli yera. Ki jini ostirgi yer anajahi, majin vos azhas dozgaan nesat mae.

Fin vitihera san mra okre hatif ta vilajer anajaha. Fin vitihera zolle mra okre vohara. San athvitiherari azh najahhey; loy athvitiherari azh vo najahhey; finsanney amelana vos athvitiherar? Anha vitiherak aranikh kijinosi majin anha assik ma fin anajaha ma fin vohara sekosshi.

addavralat - to make useful, to use
vitiherikh - ponderings, considerations
athniqar - rigidness, discipline
avvenat - to make similar, to compare
athfiezar - love, connection
athfishar - cold (n.)
athafazhar -heat (n.)
vigillosorero - season
shillikh - trust
atherinar - kindness, benevolence
atherokhar - fearlessness, bravery
athniqezar - rigidness, discipline
erokhalat - to be fearless, brave
niqat - to be rigid, disciplined
athkelenar - order
athzanar - steadyness, maintenance
athzigerezar - needs
athjavrathar  - reining in, control
athziradakhezari - devouring, expenditure (adakhat + pejorative)
k'athadavrani - with more usefulness, better
k'athazanani - with more stability, routinely
athmelisozaroon - situation, circumstance
iddolat - to make wooden, to feign
athekelenazar - disorder
safejasalat  - to be covered in hate, hateful; to be angry by nature
athvitiherari - pondering
« Last Edit: April 13, 2017, 05:54:16 pm by HoeriVezhof »
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Alizia

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Re: The Art of War Dothraki Translation
« Reply #1 on: April 10, 2017, 03:33:49 pm »
Hello, I don't check every word, but the first is vinesorat*

HoeriVezhof

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Re: The Art of War Dothraki Translation
« Reply #2 on: April 10, 2017, 06:34:11 pm »
Hello, I don't check every word, but the first is vinesorat*

Oh yeah! For some reason I thought I had used the wrong derivational affixes and went back to "fix" it and added the extra -a. Thank you!
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Re: The Art of War Dothraki Translation
« Reply #3 on: April 15, 2017, 02:34:02 pm »
Wowzers, don't this just look mighty complicated!  Some time in the coming weeks when I have the chance, I'll make sure to go through and peer edit this. Reading through this briefly, I see you took some liberties with the meanings of verbs in order to be a little more . . . philosophical, perhaps?  I loved the way you used 'oldat' to sort of mean 'give'.  I sort of interpret meaning something like 'intentionally making sure wisdom and cunning is absorbed through experience'. Truly fascinating work!
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Hrakkar

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Re: The Art of War Dothraki Translation
« Reply #4 on: April 19, 2017, 01:29:55 pm »
Athdavrazar! What a cool translation project! And some new word ideas as well.
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Choyosor

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Re: The Art of War Dothraki Translation
« Reply #5 on: May 18, 2017, 09:54:00 am »
Alright!

School is done and I've got four or so projects that have been on stand by for almost two months now, so I best get going on those before the procrastination goblin hits me over the head again.

I'll peer edit the Art of War and Bible translations today, and work on Atlas Dothraki for the next week.
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Choyosor

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Re: The Art of War Dothraki Translation
« Reply #6 on: May 18, 2017, 12:51:10 pm »
I had a lot of fun editing this passage. It was both a huge exercise in understanding vocabulary and what an informative speech would look like in Dothraki. Shafka davrae, zhey Hoerivhazhof!


Quote
Athvilajerari
Vitiherikh

Athvilajerar olda khalasar k'athvezhvenari. Me olda m’atthirar m'athdrivar. Me os che ha atthirozaraan che ha athohhararaan, majin vinesoras mae om’atharanaroon. Majin vitiheri jin mek davrakh zana, addavras vitiherikh vakkeleni majin anesoe fini nem zigeree yer shafka anajahi. Mori mek: ma Os, Asavva, Gache, Akkelenak ma Athniqar.  Akkeleni athhajar yeri shafki she mr’atheizar ma (vavveni)* mora athhajaraan dozgi.

Os olda athfiezar vi yanqosor ma khaloon. Ovvethikh mae’th vena (yeri shafki mori asili yera shafka)** ma m'atthirar m'athdrivar vo voldi mora akkate yomme athzhowakaroon.

Asavva olda m'ajjalanikh  m'asshekhikh, me athfishar m'athafazhar, m‘ kashe ma athchilar vigillosoreri[seasons].

Gache olda athhezhahar ma yatha ma zoha, me hezhaha ma qisie, me ovaha ma thifa; ma Gach fini ray nem jaz ma Gach disa, me zhowaka ma sandie.

Akkelenak olda m'athvillar ma shillikh, m'atherinar, m'atherokhar, m'athniqezar. (Akkelenak ma villa ma nem shilla ma erina ma erokhae ma niqa.)  (a good translation also)

Athniqar olda m'athkelenar mra lajasaraan ki saccheyi jila, m'athkelenar mra khasaraan, m'athzanar osaan fin (nem?) fichi (ki?) athzigerezar(i?) lajasaraan meshes, m'athjavrathar mra athziradakhezaraan masi.

Ei ko ray char jin mek davrakh. Kosi fin shila mora anajaha sekosshi; kosi fin vo shila mora anajaha vosecchi. Majin m'akkeleni m'avveni athhajar yeri shafki she athhajaroon dozgi m‘akkeleni fin ahajana. Qafi: fini khali Os mra qora? Fini oakah mra qora? Finaan adavrani m'Asavvasaan ma Gachaan? Fini khali Athniqar mra qora fini avezhvenana? Lajasar fini ahajana? Ma khasar ma lajaki fini ray lajish k'athadavrani? Fin m'azha lajasaraan qorasokh m'annitha  k'athazanani? ki jini vitiherikhi, anha laz assik ma fin anajaha ma fin vohara.

Ko fin charoe assokhaan anni m'addavrae mae anajaha sekosshi: aqqisi mae! Ko fin ma vo charoe assokhaan anni ma vo addavrae mae, hazak vohara: eqorasa mae! Addavras assokh anni ma foni davrakh fini koala avijazeri athmelisozaroon vo nem tiha meshafka vo tihi. Esinaso (ostirge)*** (kash mra qora davrakh m'athmelisozar allayafi)****.

Athvilajerar vena Os qosarvenikhi. Majin, Hash yer shafka laz ildi, hash attihi meshafka vo laz ildi; hash yer shafka nithie, attihi meshafka vo nithio; hash yer shafka qisi, attihi meshafka hezhahi; hash shafka hezhahi, attihi meshafka qisi. Annithili dozge shafki ki ma davrakhoon ido. Iddo athekelenazar ma atthasi mae kash me navvirzethaya. Hash me samvena, hash hethki moon. Hash me ahajana, hash zajja lajat mae. Hash me safejasa, hash zireyese mae. Hash me choma, hash annithili mae esittesalat. Hash mae athdisizar mra qora, ahhaqi mae. Hash lajasar nem yanqo, sachi mae. Ildi finne me ehethkae, e finne me vo zala ezat shafka. Ki jini (ostirgi)*** shafka anajahi, majin vos azhi dozgaan nesat mae.

Fin vitihera san mra (okre hatif ta vilajer)***** anajaha. Fin vitihera zolle mra okre vohara. San athvitiherari azh najahhey; loy athvitiherari azh vo najahhey; fin sanneya k’athamelanazari vos athvitiherar? Anha vitiherak aranikh kijinosi majin anha assik ma fin anajaha ma fin vohara sekosshi.

Green text means words or grammar that were added to the text.
A strike through means words or grammar that were removed from the text.
(a parenthesis and asterisk means)* a word or phrase was unknown or unclear.
Orange text means a word or phrase could be removed from the text.



*What is the meaning of the word "vavvenat"?
**I was unable to find meaning from "shafki mori asili shafka".
***What is the meaning of the word "ostirge"?
****I was unable to find meaning from "kash mra qora davrakh m'athmelisozar allayafi".
*****I was unable to find meaning from "mra okre ta vilajer".



Throughout the whole passage, your main problems were:
  • Not using formal pronouns or commands
  • An infectious ma appearing after many verbs when they weren't supposed to be there


Other than those two points you did a fantastic job and I can't wait to go onto editing your translation of Genesis 1:1-3:24



PS

Here's a cleaned up version of the passage

Quote
Athvilajerari
Vitiherikh

Athvilajerar olda khalasar k'athvezhvenari. Me olda atthirar m'athdrivar. Me os ha atthirozaraan che ha athohhararaan, majin vinesoras mae om’atharanaroon. Majin vitiheri jin mek davrakh zana, addavras vitiherikh vakkeleni majin anesoe fini nem zigeree shafka anajahi. Mori mek: Os, Asavva, Gache, Akkelenak ma Athniqar.  Akkeleni athhajar shafki mr’atheizar ma vavveni mora athhajaraan dozgi.

Os olda athfiezar vi yanqosor ma khaloon. Ovvethikh mae’th vena shafki mori asili shafka ma m'atthirar m'athdrivar vo voldi mora akkate yomme athzhowakaroon.

Asavva ajjalanikh m’asshekhikh, me athfishar m'athafazhar, m‘athchilar vigillosoreri.

Gache ma yatha ma zoha, me hezhaha ma qisie, me ovaha ma thifa; Gach fini nem jaz ma Gach disa, me zhowaka ma sandi e.

Akkelenak olda m'athvillar ma shillikh, m'atherinar, m'atherokhar, m'athniqezar.

Athniqar olda m'athkelenar mra lajasaraan ki saccheyi jila, m'athkelenar mra khasaraan, m'athzanar osaan fin nem fichi k’athzigerezari lajasaraan meshes, m'athjavrathar mra athziradakhezaraan masi.

Ei ko ray char jin mek davrakh. Kosi fin shila mora anajaha sekosshi; kosi fin vo shila mora anajaha vosecchi. Majin akkeleni m'avveni athhajar shafki she athhajaroon dozgi m‘akkeleni fin ahajana. Qafi: fini khali Os mra qora? Fini oakah mra qora? Fin adavrani Asavvasaan ma Gachaan? Fini khali Athniqar mra qora? Lajasar fini ahajana? Ma khasar ma lajaki fini ray lajish k'athadavrani? Fin azha lajasaraan qorasokh m’annitha k’athazanani? ki jini vitiherikhi, anha laz assik fin anajaha ma fin vohara.

Ko fin charoe assokhaan anni anajaha sekosshi: aqqisi mae! Ko fin vo charoe assokhaan anni, hazak vohara: eqorasa mae! Addavras assokh anni ma foni davrakh fini koala avijazeri athmelisozaroon meshafka vo tihi. Esinaso ostirge kash mra qora davrakh m'athmelisozar allayafi.

Athvilajerar vena Os qosarvenikhi. Majin, Hash shafka laz ildi, hash attihi meshafka vo laz ildi; hash shafka nithie, attihi meshafka vo nithio; hash shafka qisi, attihi meshafka hezhahi; hash shafka hezhahi, attihi meshafka qisi. Annithili dozge shafki ma davrakhoon ido. Iddo athekelenazar ma atthasi mae kash me navvirzethaya. Hash me samvena, hash hethki moon. Hash me ahajana, hash zajja lajat mae. Hash me safejasa, hash zireyese mae. Hash me choma, hash annithili mae esittesalat. Hash mae athdisizar mra qora, ahhaqi mae. Hash lajasar nem yanqo, sachi mae. Ildi finne me ehethkae, e finne me vo zala ezat shafka. Ki jini ostirgi shafka anajahi, majin vos azhi dozgaan nesat mae.

Fin vitihera san mra okre hatif ta vilajer anajaha. Fin vitihera zolle mra okre vohara. San athvitiherari azh najahhey; loy athvitiherari azh vo najahhey; fin sanneya k’athamelanazari vos athvitiherar? Anha vitiherak aranikh kijinosi majin anha assik fin anajaha ma fin vohara sekosshi.


« Last Edit: May 19, 2017, 03:28:22 am by Choyosor »
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Zhav

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Re: The Art of War Dothraki Translation
« Reply #7 on: May 18, 2017, 01:54:09 pm »
I had a lot of fun editing this passage. It was both a huge exercise in understanding vocabulary and what an informative speech would look like in Dothraki. Shafka davrae, zhey Hoerivhazhof!


***What is the meaning of the word "ostirge"?


It means "plan". A compound noun, derived from "os" + "dirge".

First used in Season 6 Episode 3, I believe. https://wiki.dothraki.org/Season_Six_Dothraki_Dialogue#Episode_3_-_Oathbreaker

Choyosor

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Re: The Art of War Dothraki Translation
« Reply #8 on: May 18, 2017, 07:26:42 pm »
Ah. Alright.
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HoeriVezhof

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Re: The Art of War Dothraki Translation
« Reply #9 on: June 04, 2017, 10:50:53 pm »
Woaf! I've been away a while! I'll have to take some time to look over the edits and fix my copy accordingly, but to answer some questions:

Quote
*What is the meaning of the word "vavvenat"?
Should be avvenat - to compare. I don't know why I added the extra v- in the text.

Quote
**I was unable to find meaning from "shafki mori asili shafka".
Ovvethikh mae’th vena shafki mori asili shafka - Their[the people's, referencing singular yanqosor] goals must be as yours [so that] they will follow you. The lack of a conjunction between the main clause and the subordinate clause [in the future tense to express purpose] does look odd to me, but that's how DJP said purpose is expressed so, there ya go. Also mori should be me to agree with yanqosor, my bad.

Quote
***What is the meaning of the word "ostirge"?
already answered, thank you, Zhav!

Quote
****I was unable to find meaning from "kash mra qora davrakh m'athmelisozar allayafi".
Esinaso ostirge kash mra qora davrakh m'athmelisozar allayafi. - Change [your] plan when [you] have the advantage[lit. "useful thing"] and the happenstance/occation/occurence [from melisolat] pleases[i.e. favors it, allows it, could use azhat instead, but personally I like allayafat]

Quote
*****I was unable to find meaning from "mra okre ta vilajer".
Fin vitihera san mra okre hatif ta vilajer anajaha. - [he] who ponders many times in his tent before doing battle will win. vilajero's accusative should probably be vilajere instead of vilajer, though. Could also probably exchange fin for rek

Like I said when I posted this, this was a ROUGH translation I had done like two days before posting, so it's no surprise there's a ton of errors! I also struggled with the text's POV, whether it should be written addressing a leader [using Shafka] or being more general, addressing the nation [using "we", kisha]. I settled on Shafka, treating the text as if it were a gift to a Khal personally translated.
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Hrakkar

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Re: The Art of War Dothraki Translation
« Reply #10 on: June 05, 2017, 01:12:17 pm »
I love to watch how the folks here are working together to make these kinds of projects successful. Klingon adopted "Hamlet', Na'vi adopted "The Lion King" (not my doing!). Now, it looks like Dothraki will adopt "The Art of War"!

P.S. I stickied this thread!
« Last Edit: June 05, 2017, 01:16:35 pm by Hrakkar »
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Choyosor

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Re: The Art of War Dothraki Translation
« Reply #11 on: June 06, 2017, 11:02:05 am »
No fair! Hoeri gets two stickied threads and I get none?! A plague upon your house, Hrakkar!  ;)


No, but in all seriousness I think that this will be good enough to publish if we keep working on it. It certainly has the same novelty factor as the projects made by the Klingon and Na'vi community!
« Last Edit: June 06, 2017, 11:12:02 am by Choyosor »
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Choyosor

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Re: The Art of War Dothraki Translation
« Reply #12 on: June 06, 2017, 11:09:32 am »
San athchomari shafkea, zhey Hoeri. Timvir ohazhoe m'athdavrazaroon, m'Athvilajerari allayafa anna ajjin!
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